tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425653.post113375386802512914..comments2023-08-11T11:25:58.800-04:00Comments on Bride Without Spot: Word of FaithCarolynhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03726204130965305300noreply@blogger.comBlogger53125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425653.post-1134572888820895062005-12-14T10:08:00.000-05:002005-12-14T10:08:00.000-05:00Bryan, I don't like bar-b-qued people either! :)I ...Bryan, I don't like bar-b-qued people either! :)<BR/><BR/>I most definitely love my discussions with Bryan. As you said, Carolyn, he's very civil - as we all are, I think. And we're actually on the same page about many things - this one area is the biggie, though. Which is fine. It doesn't mean that either one of us isn't saved.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425653.post-1134530628850694512005-12-13T22:23:00.000-05:002005-12-13T22:23:00.000-05:00lorna, i'm so sorry, i thought i had answered your...lorna, i'm so sorry, i thought i had answered your post.<BR/><BR/>i'm so sorry for your loss. it is this type of situation that breaks my heart in this sort of discussion and causes me to believe that there must be a middle ground.<BR/><BR/>hugs.Carolynhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03726204130965305300noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425653.post-1134530345145461212005-12-13T22:19:00.000-05:002005-12-13T22:19:00.000-05:00bryan ... actually, if i may say, i do not think i...bryan ... actually, if i may say, i do not think i would stuff you in the same sphere as the individuals i am struggling with in the church.<BR/><BR/>you have been wayyy too humble, graceful, and respectful for that.<BR/><BR/>i'm sure gayla, in spite of your previous discussions would agree.<BR/><BR/>be blessed.Carolynhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03726204130965305300noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425653.post-1134530214739676722005-12-13T22:16:00.000-05:002005-12-13T22:16:00.000-05:00bryan, you have not been barbequed. i don't like ...bryan, you have not been barbequed. i don't like cooked people. lol ;)<BR/><BR/>i've certainly taken all of your comments into consideration. i'm thinking on them, praying on them and asking the Lord to show me.<BR/><BR/>i believe that the healing power of God is available to us all, but in His time.<BR/><BR/>thanks so much for a fantastic discussion. i appreciate more than i can tell you how peaceful and respectful this discussion has been!<BR/><BR/>bless you all!Carolynhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03726204130965305300noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425653.post-1134527022809964192005-12-13T21:23:00.000-05:002005-12-13T21:23:00.000-05:00Hi Everyone,I see I've been barbequed. Okay, I can...Hi Everyone,<BR/>I see I've been barbequed. Okay, I can handle that, as long as you consider what I say.<BR/><BR/>"people are ill due to there own fault," No, but because the devil and sin are also in the world.<BR/><BR/>"and if their not healed, it's due to their own fault." Yes, healing is always available in Jesus, just as is salvation. But not everyone believes this, and don't recieve.<BR/><BR/>"what EXACTLY do I question." That God told you or anyone who came to Him for healing, NO.<BR/><BR/>"God's ways are really hard to understand." I don't agree; Paul preached the simplicity of Christ. The tree of life is Christ, this is simple to understand. If it's life it's Christ. If it's not life it's not Christ. So by the fruit you know the tree. Whether "the tree of the knowledge of good and evil". Or, "the tree of life".<BR/><BR/>For my last arguement I will say this; There is a song that high-lights my thought. "if the Lord says I am, then I am." 1 peter 2:24. "He himself bore our sins in his body on the tree, so that we might die to sins and live for righteousness; by his wounds you have been healed."<BR/><BR/>This is the word of God. And This is The Real End!<BR/><BR/>Blessing and Comfort be with your spirit in Christ.<BR/>Bryanpete porterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13723844160780051220noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425653.post-1134492438237191962005-12-13T11:47:00.000-05:002005-12-13T11:47:00.000-05:00Lorna, I'm so sorry for your loss. And, it makes ...Lorna, I'm so sorry for your loss. And, it makes perfect sense.<BR/><BR/>That's the point - it is GOD who is the giver of life, and it GOD who takes it away. And it is GOD who heals.<BR/><BR/>And the Bible is clear. Sometimes we are ill (or whatever trial it might be) because of sin, sometimes it is satan (through the EXPRESS PERMISSION, thereby the will of God) and sometimes it is God Himself who brings it.<BR/><BR/>Bryan, you dance around it, but you never actually come out and say it - people are ill due to their own fault. And if they're not healed, it's due to their own fault. That is what you beleive, is it not?<BR/><BR/><I>"Gayla said; "at this point God's answer to "healing" is no." I question that, not the word."</I><BR/><BR/>What EXACTLY do you question? What EXACTLY are you saying here? Do you think I'm lying when I tell you that my husband is a godly man? That he is a man of faith? That he TRUSTS God, and what He has for him? That perhaps God wants to develop him, as opposed to heal him? That even in the midst of a debilitating (sp?) disease, my husband trusts that God's ways are RIGHT and GOOD? That his disease doesn't change the righteousness or the goodness of God? <BR/><BR/><I>"God's ways are REALLY hard to understand a lot of the time."</I><BR/><BR/>Exactly, Lorna. He TELLS us that His ways and thoughts are higher than ours! That is why we TRUST Him, that His purposes will be accomplished, as we read in His word that they always have been. <BR/><BR/>God is not Santa Claus. How dare we expect the God of the universe, the Creator of all things - including us - to answer all things we ask according to what WE want. It is about Him, not us. It is about His glory, His name and His renown. He will bring that glory in any manner He so chooses. <BR/><BR/>Oh, Carolyn, sorry about the rant. :) I think you're right - you have to pray for these people; show them your humility before God, and guide them in these things. God is the only one who can pierce their hearts with Truth. I have seen people who think that healing is practically automatic in utter despair and confusion when their loved one isn't healed, and in fact, dies.<BR/><BR/>Roger's sister's mother-in-law, for example. Her husband, some of the family, their church family - they were just dumbfounded when she actually died. And then they blamed her and themselves for not 'praying hard enough' or not having 'enough faith' to make her well. They completely took God out of the equation - as if it all depended on them! This is a VERY wrong and deciving doctrine. <BR/><BR/>The End!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425653.post-1134482350719869092005-12-13T08:59:00.000-05:002005-12-13T08:59:00.000-05:00our faith will make us wellnot our lack of faith i...our faith will make us well<BR/><BR/>not our lack of faith is what makes us ill<BR/><BR/>God's ways are REALLY hard to understand a lot of the time. My goddaughter was ill most of her little life. We buried her few weeks after her 7th birthday this year.<BR/><BR/>We prayed<BR/>We fasted<BR/>We prayed <BR/>We praised Him<BR/>We love Him<BR/>We cried with Him<BR/>We cried out to Him<BR/>We repented<BR/>We tithed better<BR/>We prayed more<BR/>We fasted again<BR/>We encouraged one another<BR/><BR/>and at the end of the day we stood around her coffin united in our love for her, for one another and our bewilderment that our prayers hadnt been anwered the way we wanted.<BR/><BR/>It was not our lack of faith that was 'the problem' - I do not believe that - simply that God had other plans.<BR/><BR/>His ways are wonderful but often very hard. Nellie isn't in pain or suffereing anymore, but we miss her dearly. And that's ok. That's how we honour her little life. With tears and with thankfulness for having known her.<BR/><BR/>Does any of this make sense?see-through faithhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10130170262035064482noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425653.post-1134444659626557852005-12-12T22:30:00.000-05:002005-12-12T22:30:00.000-05:00Hi Carolyn,In all our ways we have to trust in the...Hi Carolyn,<BR/>In all our ways we have to trust in the love of the Lord; in spite of all our faults, whether young or old.<BR/>Be Blessed,<BR/>Bryanpete porterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13723844160780051220noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425653.post-1134399407975242712005-12-12T09:56:00.000-05:002005-12-12T09:56:00.000-05:00what i meant above is the pride of those who sugge...what i meant above is the pride of those who suggest that our brothers and sisters who are ill are somehow deficient in their faith. :oCarolynhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03726204130965305300noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425653.post-1134399312568985312005-12-12T09:55:00.000-05:002005-12-12T09:55:00.000-05:00The faith of God is a product of Himself. So with ...<I>The faith of God is a product of Himself. So with us it is God the Spirit who imparts his life of faith in us and through. Apart from God there is no faith or life. </I><BR/>it is funny how we have been trying to say the same thing, bryan. <BR/><BR/>yes, the measure of delight and weight we give the Word ... and that i do. this bringing me from glory to glory, understanding Him. intimate with Him. this being the Spritual aspect which flows to every other part of us.<BR/><BR/>if i am at peace with God in my Spiit ... walking in the Spirit ... my soul and my body will relax and i will enjoy more health.<BR/><BR/>i couldnt' agree with you more on this, bryan!<BR/><BR/>the sticking point remains those who are presently ill, doesn't it? i was thinking about this last night.<BR/><BR/>walking in the Spirit, we pray for those who are presently ill (call the elders) and do not make them feel that their faith is less because they are sick. faith is a gift, anyway.<BR/><BR/>there is my sticking point and it appears it is merely the pride of those i am dealing with. and pride is never something that i will attempt to find the middle ground on. i'll just love them where they are and teach them on humility.<BR/><BR/>how's that? are we any closer?<BR/><BR/>gayla??<BR/>bryan??<BR/>anyone else??Carolynhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03726204130965305300noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425653.post-1134359597415369452005-12-11T22:53:00.000-05:002005-12-11T22:53:00.000-05:00Carolyn,The faith of God is a product of Himself. ...Carolyn,<BR/>The faith of God is a product of Himself. So with us it is God the Spirit who imparts his life of faith in us and through. Apart from God there is no faith or life. <BR/><BR/>Here is our part; the measure of delight, and weight that we give to the word, the more importance and submission to it, the greater we honor and obey and heed the word regardless of our own thoughts and understanding or opinions. <BR/><BR/>If we follow hard after the truth of God. Then to our great joy we find that God is pleased to give us more light and even the light of His own presence, so that we may see and appreciate and apprehend that which God has accomplish, and will accomplish for us and through us so that we can worship in truth and in spirit.<BR/><BR/>God then causes faith to be generated in us, enabling us to believe in Him for even greater things. It is God who works in us. And according to the place we give His word, we will in His light, see light.<BR/><BR/>We are all growing in the Lord to one degree or another. That is good, only we are not to judge the word by human experience. The word is of God, and not of man. We are to bring the word into human experience to effect the will of God. And this by the direction of the Spirit.<BR/><BR/>In this Jesus becomes the faith in us by which we believe in Him, and it is also the faith that belongs to Him. The gift of God is Christ, and the faith in us is also Christ.<BR/><BR/>Be Blessed,<BR/>Bryanpete porterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13723844160780051220noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425653.post-1134354187832367012005-12-11T21:23:00.000-05:002005-12-11T21:23:00.000-05:00bryan, i am sorry if my post offended you. that w...bryan, i am sorry if my post offended you. that was not my intention.<BR/><BR/>my understanding of the doctrine is that it is the strength and faith and knowledge of the individual ... reminding God of His promises, Word, etc. that's what i meant by 'you ... (or us) ... you ... you. i didn't mean you as in bryan!<BR/><BR/>i was simply trying to state that it is us working with God. the Scriptures often tell us it is <I>trhough</I> Christ ...<BR/><BR/>does that make sense? i pray i've been able to express myself in a way which can be understood.Carolynhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03726204130965305300noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425653.post-1134349123251744632005-12-11T19:58:00.000-05:002005-12-11T19:58:00.000-05:00Carolyn,you..you..you.. it is but God.. not but I?...Carolyn,<BR/>you..you..you.. it is but God.. not but I? Where did this come from! Have I elevated man over God or his word? <BR/>Gayla said; "at this point God's answer to "healing" is no." I question that, not the word.<BR/><BR/>Anyway if you can't believe me then you would not recieve anything from me.<BR/>Bryanpete porterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13723844160780051220noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425653.post-1134311768516478722005-12-11T09:36:00.000-05:002005-12-11T09:36:00.000-05:00hi gayla. i so understand what you are saying and...hi gayla. i so understand what you are saying and think i might have the answer to the balance of the middle. bear with me and see if you agree with this:<BR/><BR/>God's healing is always available and your precious Roger has received it in spirit and soul. the body part is his and it is on its way. i know you believe that. God's grace is sufficient for the present time where the healing has not manifested yet, but the power that raised Christ from the dead is present in him and will bring healing ... in God's time.<BR/><BR/>bryan, does that fit in? i simply cannot agree with the eventual outworking of what we've been discussing - ie., if you are not healed, it is because your faith is lacking or you are not walking in the Spirit or you .. you.. you... <BR/><BR/>i just cannot swallow that. but ... i certainly agree that the healing is there available for us. this is where God's sovereignty and our faith must meet. it is 'but God ... ' not 'but i ... '<BR/><BR/>it is still His time and not ours. He knows the plans He has for us and He knows when this will come. it is His plan and His time. we need to lne up under that and trust Him to work out all things for the good. and continue to speak it in agreement with the Scriptures.<BR/><BR/>i know from my counselling practice that if my clients come in mumbling and sad and complaining that all i have to do is teach them how to speak the truth of God's Word and they leave encouraged. when they speak life into their circumstances, they may not immediately change in the physical, but their spirits are encouraged and life is easier.<BR/><BR/>does that make sense? does that language 'fit'? i'm still trying.Carolynhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03726204130965305300noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425653.post-1134252197561752952005-12-10T17:03:00.000-05:002005-12-10T17:03:00.000-05:00Gayla,God answer to healing is always "Yes". He is...Gayla,<BR/><BR/>God answer to healing is always "Yes". He is the same yesterday, today, and forever.<BR/><BR/>Be Blessed,<BR/>Bryanpete porterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13723844160780051220noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425653.post-1134252011731132382005-12-10T17:00:00.000-05:002005-12-10T17:00:00.000-05:00Hi Carolyn,Your example; you cannot speak that you...Hi Carolyn,<BR/>Your example; you cannot speak that you are ill. Our words have power so we need to watch what we say. But in James he says, "is any sick among you", so denial is not the way. <BR/><BR/>As a person of authority, such as a minister, we have to be watchful against pride. So James concludes, "let them call for the elders", in Christ there is no one man show, only one God.<BR/><BR/>"They believe there is no need for deliverance as the enemy was defeated". The last enemy to be defeated is death, are they going to die? Then the ministry is valid. <BR/><BR/>It would be wonderful if every Christian came into this new life with full power and wisdom and understanding. Walked in the spirit, and followed God with the whole heart. Triumpant and went from victory to victory, from faith to faith, and from glory to glory. <BR/><BR/>So then the present doctrines, no matter what they are have errors. Or do these leader claim that they can produce such a man or woman every-time without fault? This then is "your language", produce all this, the will of God for everyone, and then I'll agree you have a perfect wisdom. Show me the fruit!!<BR/><BR/>Is this arrogance, no. Paul preached such a gospel with power. There is no need to apolize for truth.<BR/><BR/>Hi Gayla, my good friend I ask you to consider Paul's admonition; 1 Cor 3:21 "All things are yours, whether Paul or Apollos or Cephas or the world or life or death or the present or the future-all are yours, and you are of Christ, and Christ is of God." And again; "no matter how many promises of God, they are all yes and Amen (so be it) in Christ. <BR/><BR/>So I think the devil has maskeraded as truth, but has told you a lie. "all are yes" in Christ. If God spared not his only begotten son, but freely offered him up for us, how will he not with Him (Jesus) freely give us all things.<BR/><BR/>Be Blessed,<BR/>Bryanpete porterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13723844160780051220noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425653.post-1134245544753860472005-12-10T15:12:00.000-05:002005-12-10T15:12:00.000-05:00Hmmmmm... I've been baptized in the Holy Spirit. ...Hmmmmm... <BR/><BR/>I've been baptized in the Holy Spirit. I do not speak in tongues.<BR/><BR/>My theology leans to the reformed side. I believe in the complete sovereignty of God.<BR/><BR/>I believe all the gifts of the Spirit are alive and active today. Nothing biblical to indicate otherwise. God equips His children with the gifts as He sees fit - sovereignly, if you will.<BR/><BR/>My husband is man of God, who has practiced the gifts of the Spirit for over 30 years. He does have the gift of tongues. He suffers chronic pain, 24/7, due to degenerative disk disease. At this point God's answer to 'healing' is no.<BR/><BR/>On which 'side' does this leave me?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425653.post-1134238929828782602005-12-10T13:22:00.000-05:002005-12-10T13:22:00.000-05:00you've got that right, bryan. i can't tell you ho...you've got that right, bryan. i can't tell you how incredible each and every day is for me.<BR/><BR/>thank you for your very kind words. i truly appreciate them.<BR/><BR/>what tires me is a lack of unity in the house. i grieve for those who walk in offense.<BR/><BR/>the division is not what you suspect. there are four individuals who are strong WOF - that's all they speak and hear - but it appears very much to the extreme side ....<BR/><BR/>example<BR/>you cannot speak that you are ill - you are healed not matter how it looks. for those who are not taught in WOF, they take it to the extreme and get hurt (offended) and will not come to church if they have a cold.<BR/><BR/>one of the leaders would not admit to the congregation that he had to be driven home one evening after a dizzy spell. they had prayed, it had left but it came back.<BR/><BR/>pride i guess.<BR/><BR/>hear my heart ... i love these people but it grieves me that they will not be honest.<BR/><BR/>then .. 'they' have spoken publically - not directly to me - against my ministry - cleansing stream - which is a discipleship ministry. but we also do deliverance. 'they' believe that there is no need for deliverance as the enemy was defeated on the cross 2,000 years ago .. so if he has place in your life, you are not saved... or mature ... or ???<BR/><BR/>sad. it has left many broken.<BR/><BR/>the worst part ... 'they' will not sit down and talk to me about it directly. my heart aches. so i have taken it upon myself to understand the theology ... thus this very fascinating discussion ... so i can find the middle ground and speak 'their' language to bring unity.<BR/><BR/>thanks ... is there anything else??Carolynhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03726204130965305300noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425653.post-1134237907679206882005-12-10T13:05:00.000-05:002005-12-10T13:05:00.000-05:00Hi Carolyn,You posted while I wasn't looking! As f...Hi Carolyn,<BR/>You posted while I wasn't looking! <BR/><BR/>As far as I can see, the "word of faith" church should be glad to have you on their roles! <BR/><BR/>I envy your position. It's better than a salesman who has a endless supply of buyers!<BR/><BR/>Of course we all have that position, but we have to go find our buyers!<BR/><BR/>What a great way to spend your days, ministering the word and Holy Ghost in power.<BR/><BR/>Be Blessed,<BR/>Bryanpete porterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13723844160780051220noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425653.post-1134237361319368992005-12-10T12:56:00.000-05:002005-12-10T12:56:00.000-05:00Hi Carolyn,Another though, there seems to be two c...Hi Carolyn,<BR/>Another though, there seems to be two camps. Those who believe that Jesus works are for today, such as the gifts of the Spirit, healing, deliverance, visions, dreams, revelations...etc.<BR/><BR/>Then there is the other camp that does not believe. These basicly think that what-ever God wants He will do sovererignly, apart from the church. Sort of a divine lottery.<BR/><BR/>Is this the division you are refering to?<BR/><BR/>Be Blessed,<BR/>Bryanpete porterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13723844160780051220noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425653.post-1134237147169552012005-12-10T12:52:00.000-05:002005-12-10T12:52:00.000-05:00funny, bryan. i'm sincerely interested .. i pray ...funny, bryan. i'm sincerely interested .. i pray you know my heart by now ... what made you think i was not a person of the Spirit?<BR/><BR/>on to your point ... i'm really loving this sharpening.<BR/><BR/>yes, Jesus did give us authority - that was the point of the Cross. coheirs, and all that. what an awesome gift! wow.<BR/><BR/>we are in such agreement here ... in reality, my ministry is one of deliverance and inner healing. even though i hold a 'secular' psychology degree, my major was Theology, thus "Christian Counselling". i teach 'secular' psychology where it agrees with the Bible .. and it does in many,many places because these men and women were studying God's image in us, right? but that's another fantastic post!<BR/><BR/>God certainly does not expect us to bring those who need healing (spirit, soul, or body) to Him, but to do it ourselves and essentially to teach it to them so they can do it themselves.<BR/><BR/>i see myself very much as the emergency room or the icu unit of the Church. i work with Holy Spirit to get them well ... they go out and make disciples! awesome!<BR/><BR/>it is done through teaching them the Word. to speak it positively, to claim it and to walk in it.<BR/><BR/>but ... i love them exactly where they are. you cannot give filet to a baby can you? but do i tell them they're a baby and make them feel inferior to my incredibly large faith? (being a little sarcastic, sorry, Lord!) no ... i love them with the love a Christ and realize i have as much brokenness that needs to be healed up - but in other areas.<BR/><BR/>so tell me (and this is not with sarcasm at all, but genuine desire for unity) ... how is that ... or my language in emnity with Word of Faith??Carolynhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03726204130965305300noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425653.post-1134233982285064202005-12-10T11:59:00.000-05:002005-12-10T11:59:00.000-05:00Hi Carolyn,"does that throw your theology out of t...Hi Carolyn,<BR/>"does that throw your theology out of the window?. No,no,no, I am glad we have this in common. Also it's a lot easier to speak of spiritual things to someone who has experience.<BR/><BR/>This is fine here; no need to move.<BR/><BR/>Back to authority;<BR/>The next thought is Jesus called his disciples and gave them authority to drive out evil spirits and to heal every disease and sickness. Matt 10. Here authority is given to believers. Notice Jesus didn't say to ask of the Father, he didn't tell them to pray. Or to bring them to Him. They (we) have the authority in His name. Some times we are waiting for the Lord to do, what He's told us to do.<BR/><BR/>Enough for now, I'll come back later. I am relieved that you are a person of the spirit so that we both can experience the greatness of the Lord.<BR/><BR/>Be Blessed,<BR/>Bryanpete porterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13723844160780051220noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425653.post-1134229009603167902005-12-10T10:36:00.000-05:002005-12-10T10:36:00.000-05:00Are you "baptised in the Holy Ghost, with the evid...<I>Are you "baptised in the Holy Ghost, with the evidence of speaking in other tongues". </I><BR/><BR/>oh yes, yes, yes, yes! does that throw your theology out of the window, bryan? <BR/><BR/>i'd love to keep this going here if you don't mind ... or we could take it over to your blog. i know there are many people reading who are not getting into the conversation.<BR/><BR/>i am seeing that there is a polarization of belief on the two sides. i'm trying to see where the two meet ... unfortunately, there seems to be unwillingness on the 'other side' to see where other theology can coexist. does that make sense or am i being too vague?Carolynhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03726204130965305300noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425653.post-1134189728772756732005-12-09T23:42:00.000-05:002005-12-09T23:42:00.000-05:00Hi Carolyn,1st; the secret things (the issues of t...Hi Carolyn,<BR/><BR/>1st; the secret things (the issues of the heart) belong to God. I know that the Lord watches over His word to perform it. Also there is the issue of authority, as in "speak to this mountain, be thou removed". But that's another discussion. It has to do with our discussion, but brings on another realm beyond what we have been talking about.<BR/><BR/>2nd; we settled,<BR/><BR/>3rd; His grace is sufficient! I was in the "word of faith" over 20yrs ago, I'm not sure of what there doctrines are now. How-ever this was given to Paul to keep him from being puffed up because of all the revelations. I don't know of anyone in that situation today.<BR/><BR/>4th; does counseling suggest that there is unbelief. No, lack of knowledge of what to believe.<BR/><BR/>Okay, so now I want to ask you a very important question. Not to judge, but so I know how to form my answers. Just a yes or no is fine with-out any explaination. Are you "baptised in the Holy Ghost, with the evidence of speaking in other tongues". <BR/><BR/>This comment box is getting long, if you perfer stop at my blog, I have a mailbox and you can e-mail me if you like, I'll be able to get your e-mail address from that.<BR/><BR/>Be Blessed,<BR/>Bryanpete porterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13723844160780051220noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425653.post-1134176508123636792005-12-09T20:01:00.000-05:002005-12-09T20:01:00.000-05:00what do you not understand, lorna??what do you not understand, lorna??Carolynhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03726204130965305300noreply@blogger.com